Updated outdoor patio ordinance being considered

Policy — By on May 18, 2011 7:13 am

City staff revisited the proposed changes to outdoor areas associated with businesses selling liquor, wine, or beer. The changes from the previous proposal aren’t substantial. The City Council’s Regulatory, Energy, and the Environment Committee will hold a public hearing on June 6th and potentially take action that day. The full City Council would potentially vote on it in mid June. Below is a summary of the changes, but you should read the ordinance itself (underlines and strike outs are changes to the existing ordinance):

- Downtown would be excluded from many of the provisions, and they’ve defined Downtown as everything inside the Mississippi River on the north, I-35W on the east, I-94 on the south and west, and I-394/3rd Ave N on the west.

- Each business outside of Downtown (why not also Downtown?) will have to a specified maximum customer capacity, which includes anyone sitting, standing, or present, including those waiting to be seated. There is no definition on how that capacity is reached, which at least one restaurateur told me is concerning due to the possible arbitrary determination that licensing could make.

- Outside of Downtown, no sound amplification or outdoor speakers after 10:00pm regardless of location. Council Member Tuthill, the ordinance’s author, had previously discussed this as necessary to curb general late night noise because she believes these speakers along with people talking are leading to loud ambient noise in the community. Apparently inspectors went out in Uptown last year and measured noise from several establishments and found that they were within the noise ordinance’s guidelines, so it’s not an issue of one or two businesses being too loud. One question that was raised to me by a resident was whether some of the noise that Council Member Tuthill is hearing is in fact from the many house gatherings and parties that take place in the Wedge during the summer.

- Outside of Downtown, there would have to be a sign asking people to be mindful of neighbors and list a phone number that would be answered by a person of authority to respond to problems. I’ve heard a couple of businesses say that if it has to be answered by the person of authority, as opposed to having them be reachable, then this is a more complicated issue as they’d have to have a dedicated line just for the authority person, which potentially would be a cost.

- The City would have the authority to reduce hours of operation of the outdoor area after the fact, simply due to the “proximity of the area to residential dwelling units, and upon considerations relating to the safety, repose, and welfare of residents, businesses, and other uses near the establishment.” Some, including myself, feel that this is concerning because it adds uncertainty to the business operation. The City already had authority to establish hours on a case-by-case basis so that they can take into consideration how close it is to homes and such. This would potentially lead to discrimination of a business for little reason other than some neighbors don’t like it and have convinced their council member that it’s too close to homes. If you’re a business and the City approves you for certain hours, you should be able to keep your hours unless you aren’t operating appropriately. A place like Stella’s, Cafeteria, It’s Greek to Me, etc may have underwritten their elaborate outdoor spaces in part due to income they receive between 10pm and their closing time, so businesses considering elaborate patios may not be able to do so if their lenders become uncomfortable with their longterm ability to collect revenue during those hours because of the possibility that the City would change their hours for little to no cause.

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Some have read the ordinance and realized that there are a number of items that are in there that they don’t agree with. Some examples include:

- Outdoor areas outside of downtown can only have a Class E license, which essentially limits entertainment to the stereo system. No bands, even acoustic bands. Doesn’t matter what hours. This requirement is already in there and isn’t changing.

- Outside of downtown, there can’t be any outdoor bars for patrons to be at. This may surprise you, as I’m sure we can all think of some examples of outdoor bars. But do you sit at them? In some cases, these bars figured out loopholes in the system that have no been closed up. Service bars are allowed.

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So if you have opinions, feel free to share them here but if you want your voice to be heard by City Hall, you should write to Business Licensing.

Thatcher Imboden

How cities work and change, how they are the product of their inhabitants and outside forces, and the resulting livability keep me thinking and dreaming about the future. I work in urban real estate development, am Past President of an Uptown business organization, grew up in Uptown, was on an Uptown neighborhood association Board, and am an Uptown and Lyn-Lake historian.

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7 Comments

  1. Lance says:

    These proposed ordinances are draconian and completely undermine what many residents would ultimately like to see Uptown turn into: a thriving second city center for Minneapolis. Why is this even being considered if inspectors found the establishments to be in compliance? Tuthill should move out to Medina if she wants to hear nary a peep.

    • Lance says:

      Hope you enjoy your last term on the city council, Meg Tuthill. Nobody in Uptown appreciates you trying to turn it into Woodbury.

  2. Cedar Phillips says:

    Aren’t there more pressing issues for Minneapolis and for Uptown? These proposals are both anti-business and anti-neighborhood. Perhaps things would be different if there was ample evidence that our local neighborhood businesses were constantly in violation of the law, but it sounds like that is not the case. The point about house parties and outdoor gatherings contributing to the overall noise level of the neighborhood is a good one. I happen to think outdoor patios add immensely to the overall appeal of Uptown, making it a more attractive place to live and visit, and resent these draconian regulations. People in Uptown KNOW that they live in an area with mixed uses, and most from time to time also enjoy sitting outside on a patio, whether at one of our local community restaurants or outside or own homes. If noise is the issue, crack down on those actually making the noise, not try to crack down on those local businesses who ARE keeping their noise levels to a legally acceptable level.

  3. Zack Farley says:

    The CARAG Neighborhood Board (Lake St. to 36th, Hennepin to Lyndale) welcomes feedback from all CARAG residents, business owners and property owners on these proposed outdoor patio ordinance changes. If you have opinions or thoughts you’d like to share, please e-mail us any time – boardatcarag.org – We want to hear from you!

    We’re also happy to send your thoughts along to the city. It is important we hear from as many people as possible when it comes to a decision that will impact our community, and that the city hears from you. Public input is always imperative.

    Please e-mail us at boardatcarag.org if you have something to share.

    Thank you Thatcher for sharing your thoughts and asking for feedback!

    ~Zack
    CARAG Board Member

  4. CarlLa says:

    As someone who supported her, Let’s face it she has been a disappointment. Uptown is Uptown & if you don’t expect some noise then you do not belong living there. Last year she caused the Cafe Barbeutte Bastille Day to stop music at 8;00 pm when it has been 10:00 pm forever in this city.

    • J. Eng says:

      Agreed! I live 1 block from Barbette and love that there is a wonderful outdoor dining area, and the once a year outdoor music is a joy to have in the neighborhood-that’s why we live here!! When I moved here there was a crappy realty office where Amore’ Victoria is now, with it’s lovely outdoor seating that is expanding to the rooftop. Can you say upgrade? for the whole of Uptown?
      The outdoor dining season is so miserably short here…why make it any shorter by shutting it down earlier on those beautiful summer nights?

  5. Nathaniel says:

    I encourage everyone to write to anyone they can – especially Tuthill herself, other City Council members, etc. Would people on this site be will to show up to the June 6th public hearing?

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